Integrated Updates - not necessarily detected
DesertJerry
15 Apr 2012
I have been assembling my new system and installing software for a couple of weeks (commented on more than once in a couple of postings).
To save time and effort I've used the RyanVM Integrator, the WMP11 slipstreamer, and DriverPacks to create an XP Pro and XP Pro x64 CD/DVD that is as up-to-date as various Update Packs, Addons, hotfixes, etc allow.
Along the same lines, for Windows 7, I've used the W7Toolkit, SoLor Updates, and other options that are part of the W7Toolkit to create a Win7 DVD that is as up-to-date as these various programs, updates, and addons allow.
In both cases: Update Packs and SoLor updates, the Windows source ends up with hundreds of updates slipstreamed/integrated into the source; thereby saving the user from downloading and installing, again, hundreds up updates/hotfixes/etc.
But, while saving the user time and effort during a new/repair install I noticed that AutoPatcher lists many updates for all of these operating systems that are probably not really needed. For instance, my recent Windows 7 update included over 300 SoLor hotfixes slipstreamed/integrated in the .WIM file and after the installation was complete a check today at Microsoft Update listed only 15 updates being required for Win7 Ultimate w/SP1 64bit; all of which were installed.
Starting AutoPatcher from within this same Win7 under Microsoft Windows - Critical Updates I counted 18 items. Under Recommended Updates I counted 12 items. Under Updated Components I counted a total of 17 items.
Microsoft office Addons is not relevant here - Office has not been installed yet, though I would point out here that Agent 2.0 Characters and Utilities is in the wrong place; Agent is a Windows feature - not part of any version of Office.
Windows Addons > Network Monitor and Parsers were all black as these items have yet to be installed.
Now, I did not cross check the items AutoPatcher listed against the hundreds of SoLor updates as I must assume AutoPatcher is designed to look for any and all applied patches/hotfixes/etc.
So, the question becomes: must the user be made aware of this disparity in using AutoPatcher and/or is a solution possible given that many patches/hotfixes/etc are directly integrated into the source?
I can open Control Panel > Windows Update > View Update History and be shown a list of all updates installed after the operating system itself was installed. If I change the location from View Update History to > Installed Updates and scroll down I am shown a listing with a heading Microsoft Windows (333) - which relates to the SoLor integrated updates plus todays updates.
This tells me the information on updates is kept somewhere and I would assume the data is available to be read by an outside program; i.e. AutoPatcher. But I have no idea as to where this information is kept or how it could be queried and compared by a program like AutoPatcher.
I would like to think I am not the only what that has noticed this possible issue with using AutoPatcher. If I have brought up an item that has no possible solution then I expect the problem to become worse as time passes and more users slipstream/integrate patches/hotfixes/etc.
To save time and effort I've used the RyanVM Integrator, the WMP11 slipstreamer, and DriverPacks to create an XP Pro and XP Pro x64 CD/DVD that is as up-to-date as various Update Packs, Addons, hotfixes, etc allow.
Along the same lines, for Windows 7, I've used the W7Toolkit, SoLor Updates, and other options that are part of the W7Toolkit to create a Win7 DVD that is as up-to-date as these various programs, updates, and addons allow.
In both cases: Update Packs and SoLor updates, the Windows source ends up with hundreds of updates slipstreamed/integrated into the source; thereby saving the user from downloading and installing, again, hundreds up updates/hotfixes/etc.
But, while saving the user time and effort during a new/repair install I noticed that AutoPatcher lists many updates for all of these operating systems that are probably not really needed. For instance, my recent Windows 7 update included over 300 SoLor hotfixes slipstreamed/integrated in the .WIM file and after the installation was complete a check today at Microsoft Update listed only 15 updates being required for Win7 Ultimate w/SP1 64bit; all of which were installed.
Starting AutoPatcher from within this same Win7 under Microsoft Windows - Critical Updates I counted 18 items. Under Recommended Updates I counted 12 items. Under Updated Components I counted a total of 17 items.
Microsoft office Addons is not relevant here - Office has not been installed yet, though I would point out here that Agent 2.0 Characters and Utilities is in the wrong place; Agent is a Windows feature - not part of any version of Office.
Windows Addons > Network Monitor and Parsers were all black as these items have yet to be installed.
Now, I did not cross check the items AutoPatcher listed against the hundreds of SoLor updates as I must assume AutoPatcher is designed to look for any and all applied patches/hotfixes/etc.
So, the question becomes: must the user be made aware of this disparity in using AutoPatcher and/or is a solution possible given that many patches/hotfixes/etc are directly integrated into the source?
I can open Control Panel > Windows Update > View Update History and be shown a list of all updates installed after the operating system itself was installed. If I change the location from View Update History to > Installed Updates and scroll down I am shown a listing with a heading Microsoft Windows (333) - which relates to the SoLor integrated updates plus todays updates.
This tells me the information on updates is kept somewhere and I would assume the data is available to be read by an outside program; i.e. AutoPatcher. But I have no idea as to where this information is kept or how it could be queried and compared by a program like AutoPatcher.
I would like to think I am not the only what that has noticed this possible issue with using AutoPatcher. If I have brought up an item that has no possible solution then I expect the problem to become worse as time passes and more users slipstream/integrate patches/hotfixes/etc.
ViroMan
15 Apr 2012
slipstreamed patches still create registry entries like they would if they were installed after windows install. I know because im using a lip streamed install and the updates showed right away. (If i remember right it was a few months ago now)
Also windows knows things are installed because there is an entry in the uninstall areas of the registry. That is where I have recently started tapping into. With the VC++ for instance.
Another thing, Yes there are alot of hot patches that may not be critical but, fix things that users may run into.
if im not making sense, sorry im tired.
Also windows knows things are installed because there is an entry in the uninstall areas of the registry. That is where I have recently started tapping into. With the VC++ for instance.
Another thing, Yes there are alot of hot patches that may not be critical but, fix things that users may run into.
if im not making sense, sorry im tired.
click-click
15 Apr 2012
DesertJerry, on 15 April 2012 - 02:25 AM, said:
Now, I did not cross check the items AutoPatcher listed against the hundreds of SoLor updates as I must assume AutoPatcher is designed to look for any and all applied patches/hotfixes/etc.
So, the question becomes: must the user be made aware of this disparity in using AutoPatcher and/or is a solution possible given that many patches/hotfixes/etc are directly integrated into the source?
So, the question becomes: must the user be made aware of this disparity in using AutoPatcher and/or is a solution possible given that many patches/hotfixes/etc are directly integrated into the source?
Autopatcher is not designed to include hot fixes which get included in the RyanVM and Solor Update Packs. The problem is that many of these hot fixes are on a request only basis and there is no direct download link to get these fixes via APUP. Sometimes these hot fixes replace a normal fix that was offered by WU and the WU fix will show up as not installed (black) because the detection is no longer valid since that fix was replaced by the hotfix. It is possible to add detections for the hotfixes, but that would require a tremendous amount of additional work and time with volunteers we don't have. If you would like to take on the task of making AP detections compatible with Solor's HotfixPack, be my guest
Bottom line is that AP is not designed to handle installation packs, switchless installers, etc. that include hot fixes that cannot be obtained via official channels. If you want to be on the bleeding edge using hotpacks etc, you will have to deal with the AP discrepancies.
